Hi, I was just reading http://www.jessicahische.is/obsessedwiththeinternet/category/andhelpingyougetpaid
and it got me thinking:

When you're selling a design (here) to someone, d'you discuss the number of shirts they would be allowed to print? Or d'you allow for unlimited runs?
  • DanielAndHisArt

    Nope, because once you send the print file, they can pretty much do whatever they want with it. Regardless of the terms and conditions or agreeing to only sell a certain number. You would never be able to truly control them from printing however many they wanted to.
  • William Henry

    Like Daniel said, you can specify the amount in the contract you set up, but theres no guarantee the client will actually follow it.
  • Anthony Smith

    i agree with above to an extent, although i think we would all benefit from giving a limited license to use our work. we may not be able to dictate how many they sell, or know how many times they reprint, but if we stated that buying the rights to use our artwork allowed the company to use it for a period of 1 year, we would earn a more respectable amount for a product that was clearly successful (if they are still selling after a year).
  • Matt Borchert

    You set that all up in the contract you send the client once you sell the final art file. You do have to trust the client enough that they will not lie to you about how many units have been sold etc, but it's really up to you to cover your own bases.

    Because of the difficulty in tracking sales from designer to client I would say more sell art files as unlimited apparel use only, with extra fees to print on other mediums. Always keep the IP of the design, however.
  • 8-bit ZOMBIE

    I can definitely see both sides of this. But as a small brand owner, setting a maximum print number or time limit for artwork is a huge turn off to me. Don't get me wrong, I can definitely see it from the artist's perspective. It's got to be a bummer to sell a design to a brand and then watch them re-print and sell that design for years. But at the same time, if it was really that easy to sell tees, why not try printing and selling your own designs? Artists spend years honing their craft but brand owners spend years building their brand and gaining a fan base. The brand is taking all the risk. There's no guarantee that a shirt design will sell well. So it seems kind of unfair for an artist to ask full price for a design and then add the stipulation that only a certain amount can be sold or that the design can only be sold for a certain amount of time. Honestly, if I was inquiring about an artist and they had that stipulation, I would probably say "thanks but no thanks" and look elsewhere. As a brand owner my money is already flying out of my pocket in a hundred different places, renting artwork isn't something I want to worry about.

    All that being said, my perspective is that of a SMALL brand owner. I'm not selling thousands upon thousands of tees. I can definitely see this applying to big brands and companies. If a brand is selling thousands of shirts, then paying to "renew" their artwork is no biggie and would be a great gesture to thank the artist for the popularity of design. But I don't have a massive budget to work with when it comes to artwork so I have to plan, scrimp and save. So that's probably why the idea of paying for artwork multiple times makes me cringe. But I just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in there since most of the brands that frequent this site are indeed small brands. And I think most of them would be thinking the same thing if an artist asked for a certain number of prints or a certain amount of time on artwork. Of course it's always a great thing to be aware and knowledgeable of your licensing and how to protect yourself and your artwork. But if you're primarily working with small brands, you also don't want to scare potential clients away.

    (Also let me say that I obviously don't know what kind of numbers you are talking about in regards to setting a limit on prints. If an artist were to set a fairly high number to protect themselves just in case the design should become a huge success, then I can see that being more applicable to small brands. But if you're talking like 100 or 200 prints, then that would probably be a deterrent to smaller lines)

    Anyway, like I said, just wanted to chime in with the small brand owner perspective. Hopefully I don't drive any of you guys away from ever wanting to work with me, hahah.
  • derek

    How is a designer gonna be able to track how many items have been sold with their print?
    I seriously wouldn't think a company is going to report back what they sell; and i don't mean this in a nasty way, they probably would be busy and forget etc.

    If a company buys a design which sells super well they will highly likely go back to that designer for more; adding the limitation on runs would be off putting.

    If your design is selling well it should be getting good exposure and you can make it work for you by using this in your own advertising & marketing. Everybody loves a winner!

    Limiting your design to apparel only is a cool idea & if they company want to do other things with it then i think they should pay .

    Margins are really tight in the t industry (for small companies anyway), so putting limitations on amount of prints would really make me think hard about the whole economics i would create from that design.
  • Craig Robson

    it is absolutely the standard practise with licensing art outside of this microsm to limit the usage period.

    obviously it works on a case by case basis and should be negotiated via a contract between the client and designer before any work commences, but keep in mind that all of the literature i have read about licensing recommends a limit of sorts. its your work so control it how you wish.

    that being said.. i have only ever limited the timeline on two or three designs ive licensed as shirt designs. most people may only do one or two runs of a design before they move on so it doesnt concern me too much. ive limited it before for two reasons: 1. they didnt have the budget that was ideal for the job, so i cut the timeline down to one single print run (or X amount of shirts) which means they can print what they need with the design as a start up (and within their budget) and if things go well they can renew the contract, if not i get my art back.
    2. they are pushing 10,000 units or more and can afford to renew a license after a period if they want to, no skin off their budget and good for me if it does well.

    in all of these situations its just a case of common sense, use your brain and talk openly with whoever you are working with. you'll work out when and how these things will be applicable in no time.
  • HarryDiaz

    Anthony Smith said:i agree with above to an extent, although i think we would all benefit from giving a limited license to use our work. we may not be able to dictate how many they sell, or know how many times they reprint, but if we stated that buying the rights to use our artwork allowed the company to use it for a period of 1 year, we would earn a more respectable amount for a product that was clearly successful (if they are still selling after a year).
  • sad

    Thanks for taking the time to reply. I think I understand it better now. :-) My next question would've been about 'licensing' a design to two different companies, but I don't think I need to ask that any more.

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